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  #1  
Old 05-14-2008, 04:11 PM
STR1DER STR1DER is offline
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Default Where's the New Firmware?!

We've been nice about this for long enough. The pilot's been around for a while now, and we're still waiting for new firmware. Does anyone know what is going on? There's just a few annoying little things that keep this player from being awesome. Let me say this again: ANNOYING.

Open the source, and let us fix it if the powers-that-be don't have the time/resources.

I know, I know--someone's gonna tell me "It's almost done...It'll be here soon..." Well, I have been patient. I have even encouraged others to buy the Pilot, having nothing but faith in the developers for an improved firmware. But it's still not here.

I'm frustrated, I need answers, and I miss my DV4G. Anyone else on the same boat?
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  #2  
Old 05-14-2008, 05:22 PM
Carbon88 Carbon88 is offline
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Default Ditto that..

let's see some commitment..
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  #3  
Old 05-14-2008, 10:28 PM
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SaruNinja SaruNinja is offline
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yeah...honestly, i come to this forum everyday in the hopes that i will see a new thread titled "NEW FIRMWARE!!"

when i saw this thread, i thought for a moment there was a new firmware. darn.

maybe my birthday present will be new firmware...XD
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  #4  
Old 05-15-2008, 09:19 AM
semiquaver semiquaver is offline
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Tell me about it. I just convinced a friend to buy one, based partially on the new firmware coming out soon that would iron out the more egregious bugs. I thought it was "any day now", but it's been that way for quite some time.
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  #5  
Old 05-17-2008, 11:12 AM
rhoton rhoton is offline
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Ditto for the Sport ... after they fixed the bookmark problem on the NS-DV with the latest firmware, I know what the Sport and Pilot COULD be ... but sadly both are not used at this time because no firmware upgrade...

Barb
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  #6  
Old 05-17-2008, 06:55 PM
telliott telliott is offline
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I'm sure I'm not the only one who won't be buying any new Insignia players if they release new products instead of fixing the bugs with the Pilot.

Tim
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  #7  
Old 05-18-2008, 04:09 PM
leo3 leo3 is offline
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Default Overdrive video doesn't work

Yes, no fix for the overdrive video problems without an update either. Not sure they even know that it doesn't work!!!!!
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  #8  
Old 05-20-2008, 10:46 AM
Skinjob Skinjob is offline
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I had been considering a Pilot for several months now and finally gave up based on the sad state of the FW and the total lack of response from Insignia. This is way, way too long to go without even a bug-fix patch, much less any enhancements.

Would have really liked to try Bluetooth, but I ended up getting a Sansa Fuze instead. Awesome player and Sandisk has really started turning out some great FW over the last year. Basically, excellent sound quality and great support from Sandisk swayed my decision.

I feel for you guys, I hope Insignia does the right thing by their customers, but it's pretty hard to be optimistic at this point.
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  #9  
Old 05-20-2008, 09:42 PM
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SaruNinja SaruNinja is offline
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Once you start losing potential customers because of firmware, you know it's time to release a new firmware.

We should be expecting one any month now, probably before the end of June (at the latest)








Last edited by SaruNinja; 05-21-2008 at 01:31 AM.
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  #10  
Old 05-21-2008, 02:03 AM
gantt gantt is offline
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Won't come soon enough for me. Returned mine today.

At my local Best Buys the MP3 player display areas have stands for the Pilot and/or Sport, but usually those stands are empty, unlike the iPod/Samsung/SanDisk/etc. When I bought my Pilot, the blueshirt had to ask someone where they kept them. It seems like BB is almost embarrassed to push the Pilot. I'm wondering why they're even bothering if they're just going to hide them.
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  #11  
Old 05-23-2008, 07:38 AM
vferrari vferrari is offline
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I only post this to let people know there are probably a group of people out there who are perfectly happy with this player. The features as spec'd are killer including decent onboard memory capacity, seamless playlist integration of the SD card slot, bluetooth which I use constantly in the car and on the "run", relatively decent and flexible video support including video out!, multiple headphone outputs, FM and line-in recording, support for video subscription services such as Amazon unbox, decent audio output direct and via bluetooth, and great form factor. It is my dream player and I now consider it the standard at which I will judge other players. In essence, I can now not live without the features I've listed above.

While I lament a few minor issues such as relatively long boot up times and clunky user playlist integration, I am very pleased overall and have decided to put up my Samsung YP-T9, Sansa E260, and Creative Vision M players, and my last 4GB bluetooth insignia player all up for sale because after having the Pilot for 9+ months, I find I am using no other player to "fill in the feature gaps".

When I look at the firmware bug/must have feature list, I seriously cannot get excited about what is supposedly missing from the player. Certainly not to the point where I think the player is unusable. For one thing, I don't get people's obsession with album art. When I am using the player, the last thing I consider doing is staring slack jawed at a static image of an album cover while a song is playing. It's really ridiculous AFAIC. I can see were additional lossless codec support would be valuable to some, but its not as if it doesn't already support the codecs most people would use. But to each his own...

BTW - for those of you who feel compelled to return the Pilot because of lack of firmware, you must have strong convictions about what is the best player so please fill us in on the player you DO prefer so that Pilot users can compare features and learn whether there might be a better player out there for them. That would be a real value added post rather than just complaining and stomping your feet about Insignia's passive lack of firmware support for their customers. I personally consider the Pilot overall, even with its flaws, to be BETTER than all the players I listed above, so please educate me on the player you consider to be a "Pilot Killer" - I would seriously be interested in taking a look at it provided it incorporates the "must have" features I listed above.

I do think Insignia is remiss in not getting a firmware update out. But its seriously not the end of the world, and I think a majority of users probably don't care or wouldn't even know how to perform the update. Bottom line, I don't think its seriously affecting sales. I do think it may be a sign, however, that Insignia is not serious about supporting the player for the long haul, they have another player model that will supersede the Pilot, or Insignia is trouble as a company and cannot support its engineering department. With the exception of the second item, these don't bode well for Pilot users. Again, only my opinion. I'm not saying other people should subscribe to my perspective or should not be PO'd about their particular pet peeves not being addressed by a firmware update so don't flame me.

Last edited by vferrari; 05-23-2008 at 08:01 AM.
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  #12  
Old 05-23-2008, 10:14 AM
STR1DER STR1DER is offline
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Ferrari, I'm curious as to how often you use the Pilot as a video player. I ask because this is where a majority of my gripes arise. Movies inexplicably stop and skip to the next video. Audio sync issues. This is the stuff I'm talking about. As for album art issues and the like, I tend to agree with you, but at the same time, certain features that have become standard in the leading brands should also work flawlessly on the Pilot--especially when it's sold as such. No one would buy a product if the packaging said "*some features on this product are still under development. Expect errors."

I will not argue that there are certainly a number of great features for the price. We all have our preferences. I am one that could care less about the bluetooth, which is something you obviously value. I guess I just want the player to do exactly what it's supposed to, and then just a teenie bit more. If I were to sum it up---fix the video playback issues, improve boot-up time, and increase the file # maximum.
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  #13  
Old 05-23-2008, 10:47 AM
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mattschuette mattschuette is offline
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vferrari - good point about album art, it's not at all important compared to everything the Pilot does well. That said, if you have the screen real estate, why NOT show album art? I have several albums with crappy or throw-away album art, but probably more with very nice covers. In general, if I want to see what album the currently playing song is from, I'll very quickly glance at the picture rather than wait for the tag to scroll through. Also, when some albums have art and some don't, it's all the more obvious that your overall media experience has been lowered just a notch.

I use my 4GB Pilot exclusively for music (no video, no audiobooks), so I don't see any of the more serious issues. My major gripes are startup times, playlist bungling, spotty Unicode support, and album art issues (including progressive jpeg, which affects the picture viewer too).
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  #14  
Old 05-23-2008, 01:25 PM
vferrari vferrari is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by STR1DER View Post
Ferrari, I'm curious as to how often you use the Pilot as a video player. I ask because this is where a majority of my gripes arise. Movies inexplicably stop and skip to the next video. Audio sync issues. This is the stuff I'm talking about. As for album art issues and the like, I tend to agree with you, but at the same time, certain features that have become standard in the leading brands should also work flawlessly on the Pilot--especially when it's sold as such. No one would buy a product if the packaging said "*some features on this product are still under development. Expect errors."

I will not argue that there are certainly a number of great features for the price. We all have our preferences. I am one that could care less about the bluetooth, which is something you obviously value. I guess I just want the player to do exactly what it's supposed to, and then just a teenie bit more. If I were to sum it up---fix the video playback issues, improve boot-up time, and increase the file # maximum.

Str1der,

Thanks for the response. I would say I use it about once or twice a week to view weekly programming I've recorded on my DVR or to view video while working out. Of course it must be converted to Divx for playback compatibility on the pilot but the software I use pretty much does that faster than real time playback so its just a matter of letting the converter run overnight or for a few hours to get several hours of playback material that I just drag onto an 8GB SD card and navigate to it using folder navigation on the Pilot. I have not seen the signifiant issues you have reported. I agree that if I had the video performance issues that you have been reporting with my Unbox videos or home grown conversion, I would not be a happy camper. But other than the occasional hiccup during ffw or rewinding a feature length video (and recovery merely takes a quick rewind jog), I do not have issues if I just let the video play through uninterrupted. While not home theater quality, I really like the video out feature for quick an dirty larger screen video viewing in the hotel room or on the road (can plug it into the van's video player an avoid the need to bring along a lot of DVD's for the kids as one 8GB SD can easily handle enough video for a short multi-day road trip -very convenient).

Yeah, I pretty much am spoiled by bluetooth, the freedom of bringing my player into my car and having it automatically pair with my car audio system with NO WIRES attached the player is just awesome. I use the player as if it were a small remote control to skip to the next track or create an instant, on-the-fly artist, album, or genre playlist or just let it go with Play All random play. Same goes for being able to work out/jog/bike/do yardwork with my lightweight, water resistant Motorola S9 bluetooth stereo headset and armband case to hold the Pilot with, again, NO WIRES to get tangled during these activities is just great. So its pretty much a must have for me. I also like the Pilot implementation which routes the bluetooth output "after" it goes through the equalizer. Probably falls in the don't know what you are missing category for most people.

Take it easy.

Last edited by vferrari; 05-23-2008 at 01:35 PM.
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  #15  
Old 05-23-2008, 01:30 PM
vferrari vferrari is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mattschuette View Post
vferrari - good point about album art, it's not at all important compared to everything the Pilot does well. That said, if you have the screen real estate, why NOT show album art? I have several albums with crappy or throw-away album art, but probably more with very nice covers. In general, if I want to see what album the currently playing song is from, I'll very quickly glance at the picture rather than wait for the tag to scroll through. Also, when some albums have art and some don't, it's all the more obvious that your overall media experience has been lowered just a notch.

I use my 4GB Pilot exclusively for music (no video, no audiobooks), so I don't see any of the more serious issues. My major gripes are startup times, playlist bungling, spotty Unicode support, and album art issues (including progressive jpeg, which affects the picture viewer too).
Matt,

Thanks for replying and keeping the discussion alive. Don't want to come across too harsh against people who really want/need decent album art support, but I just wonder about perspective for some people who have posted saying the album art support shortcomings are deal breakers. I too like taking advantage of the album art support to be able to glance down and see whats playing etc. And though I do have some OCD tendancies, I cannot get too excited or disappointed as the case may be with the Pilot's incosistencies wrt handling album art, but I can see how it can be annoying to some people. I do think the existence of a bug that crashes the player if a certain jpg file is used is inexcusable and should be fixed but I don't use the player to view non-album-art jpegs so I don't have a beef there. You seem to pretty much have the same gripes I do, especially startup time which IS annoying. Take care.
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  #16  
Old 05-23-2008, 11:44 PM
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SaruNinja SaruNinja is offline
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The main thing i want from a firmware update is being able to make the Now Playing list into a Playlist for future use...
The other thing i suggested (but it's not important) is an alarm clock function

My player has it's bugs (like songs starting halfway through), but i don't mind those...
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  #17  
Old 05-25-2008, 05:45 PM
drwowe drwowe is offline
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I have some more serious bugs: like I'm seeing devlogo.fil instead of the track names in my bookmarks, and the other day all the artists titles and albums of all my songs started showing as "unknown", and the only way I could fix it was to reformat the internal memory. Several times I've had the player become unbootable (would freeze creating the library) after uploading some new songs. It's so bad that I'm afraid to put any files in the internal memory until I've tested them first on the SD card (where I can eject it if it causes problems). Also, the 2000 song limit blows, I have a 16 gig SD card, and my player is filled with 1960 songs and I still have 6 gigs of free space I won't be able to use.

The crashing and data corruption bugs especially deserved a firmware update months ago. New features I don't mind waiting for, but this is ridiculous. I love the hardware and feature set, but I can't stand the awful firmware.

Why can't they release beta firmwares like other companies? I can't imagine a beta firmware being any buggier than the current "release".
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  #18  
Old 05-25-2008, 08:07 PM
vferrari vferrari is offline
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WRT to the 2000 item limit, I have over 2545 media items showing up in my library (I have them spread across the 8GB internal and an 8GB external SD card) so I think you can have 2000 on internal (tho you probably can't fit 2000 on 8GB) and 2000 on external memory, so if your total is 1960 spread across both the internal and external memories then you have a long way to go before you hit a limit. Also, take advantage of the Pilot's video playback capability to fill up that unused memory, with the large file sizes associated with video, you can fit several full length movies, TV shows, or even music videos on that 16GB card and not even come close to any media item limit. I have noticed that playlists are tuncated to 400 items.

Going over to the DAP Review forums it appears that there is much uncertainty and conjecture regarding the file item limit on the Pilot - some swear they cannot get more than 2000 items to show up in the media manager, some say its 2000 per memory device (i.e., internal and external are counted seperately) and others say its 3000 or even 4000 items and some say it depends whether you are in UMS or MTP mode. The only confirmation, of sorts, was provided by Digitaldel, an Insignia insider and member of their MP3 player design team (who also used to regulary post here) who states: "Yes, presently the way it works is that you get 2K + 2K for Int/Ext and 3K Int assuming you have no external. This would reference to some of the findings on this or the post over at ABI. We are looking at what we can do to increase this limit." That was posted in November 2007 and still no new firmware.

Unfortunately, I think the writing is on the wall that Insignia is either not going to support the Pilot for the long haul or is coming out with something new as Best Buy is blowing out the 8GB Pilot for $99 bucks this weekend. Use the readily available online 10% - 12% coupons and you have yourself a fine 8GB, bluetooth, audio/video player with SD expansion for less than 90 bones.

Last edited by vferrari; 05-26-2008 at 04:32 PM. Reason: Added info from DAP Forum
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  #19  
Old 05-27-2008, 06:45 PM
DigitalAxis DigitalAxis is offline
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With all these delays, I've been wondering if Digitaldel is their ENTIRE firmware development department.
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  #20  
Old 05-27-2008, 11:16 PM
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SaruNinja SaruNinja is offline
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That's not a very pleasing thought...
i still have patience though. The firmware will come...someday..XD
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