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  #21  
Old 07-27-2012, 05:06 PM
brosko brosko is offline
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Originally Posted by crabocado View Post
It's nice to know the 4 and 5 are glass, but is the 4.2? Hopefully?

Anyway, it depends on your personality. I am all about avoiding irreversible events. If you go without a screen protector, you are asking for keys, random pocket gadgets, and most likely uncontrolled grit blowing in from wherever to scratch your screen. Just to give one example, beaches can have a lot of quartz, and I think that can scratch glass. Without a screen protector, every act of wiping the screen becomes a slightly risky undertaking, because of tiny bits of junk on your fingers or cloth.

Several people said "if it's gonna scratch the screen, it'll go right through the screen protector". That's true, but the point of the screen protector is not to stop a determined person with a cutting tool. It's to slow down things that might otherwise get to the screen. I am confident that one of the big risks is random grit, which is small enough that a screen protector should be very effective.

In the end, scratching the plastic protector is fixable, scratching the screen is not, so it seems a slam dunk to me.
This is exactly what i have been saying. it is to PROTECT the screen. it will take all thse accidental little scratches that the screen would have taken.
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  #22  
Old 07-27-2012, 07:20 PM
MusicalBox MusicalBox is offline
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Originally Posted by FrankB2 View Post
Hi Barry,
I tried to find out what SGP screens are made of, but couldn't. Reviews on CNET, etc, simply said it wasn't AMOLED. This video convinced me that my wife's SGP needed some protection: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ivjnz...feature=relmfu My wife could break an anvil, so the Zagg thing gives me some comfort, although I did have to remind her that it won't help with impacts (or back pockets).

The Zagg protector is warrantied for life, and you can return it for a replacement. They do charge $3.99 to ship one out, but they have to make up the cost of plastic film somehow.
Nice demonstration... but there is a lie somewhere is this video.

The top part of the screen is supposed to have no coverage.
But looks closely. This is just after they rip off the bottom part :



Looks to me like there is a protection on the top part as well...
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  #23  
Old 07-27-2012, 08:00 PM
barryem barryem is offline
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Originally Posted by FrankB2 View Post
Hi Barry,
I tried to find out what SGP screens are made of, but couldn't. Reviews on CNET, etc, simply said it wasn't AMOLED. This video convinced me that my wife's SGP needed some protection: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ivjnz...feature=relmfu My wife could break an anvil, so the Zagg thing gives me some comfort, although I did have to remind her that it won't help with impacts (or back pockets).

The Zagg protector is warrantied for life, and you can return it for a replacement. They do charge $3.99 to ship one out, but they have to make up the cost of plastic film somehow.
First, it's an LCD screen, not AMOLED, but that has nothing to do with how scratch resistant it is. Over the screen there's a hardened glass shield. That's what can scratch.

That particular Dremel grinding tool is made of silicon carbide, one of the very hardest substances known. It's actually the 4th hardest substance known. Only 3 other substances exist that it can't scratch. You really don't want to put your SGP in your pocket if you have a bunch of silicon carbide in there.

Now look real closely at that video and you'll see that he isn't exerting any pressure on the tool. He doesn't really have to. There are millions of little cutting edges on the surface of that tool that's rotating above 30,000 RPM. It's going to abrade anything it touches.

But what if he had put a little pressure on it? You can be very sure it would have eaten through that screen protector like it was nothing. All of the glass would have been scratched. It wouldn't take much pressure and there wouldn't be much difference between the scratching at the top and at the bottom. This was a test that was very carefully done to convince people to buy their products. It's not dishonest. It's just salesmanship.

If the screen protector gives you some peace of mind then, of course, use it. I sometimes buy an extended warranty for a product I really care about even though I know it's silly as an investment but I want the peace of mind. That makes sense. Just be sure you know why you're doing it. It's not about protecting your screen, it's about protecting you.

Barry
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  #24  
Old 07-27-2012, 08:20 PM
barryem barryem is offline
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Originally Posted by Blackdog View Post
The screen is not glass; it's plastic. Someone on the board here a few months ago volunteered to take a needle or a nail to his screen, and was easily able to scratch it.
That's the thread at the following link:
http://www.anythingbutipod.com/forum...ad.php?t=66917

Someone claimed to have tested it with a needle and a nail and scratched it. Someone else said he could tell it was plastic by the sound, which, of course, isn't something you can judge it by.

Then later in the thread someone else tried to scratch it with glass and wasn't able to and concluded that it was glass after all.

I did some googling and I wasn't able to confirm that the screen is glass but I'm pretty sure it is. If not, then it's probably worth using a screen protector if you're not real careful with it. My guess is that it's hardened glass.

There are a number of scratch tests of Samsung phones on Youtube and they do very well in them. There are others for Gorilla Glass, which does very well. You'd have to work at scratching that stuff. That's not to say it can't happen. Anything can happen.

Barry
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  #25  
Old 07-27-2012, 08:32 PM
barryem barryem is offline
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Originally Posted by crabocado View Post
Just to give one example, beaches can have a lot of quartz, and I think that can scratch glass.
Sand does have a high quartz content. That's why glass is made from sand.

Of course the glass is refined and treated. I'm not sure if it's harder than sand or not.

Barry
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  #26  
Old 07-27-2012, 08:34 PM
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Originally Posted by barryem View Post
First, it's an LCD screen, not AMOLED, but that has nothing to do with how scratch resistant it is. Over the screen there's a hardened glass shield. That's what can scratch.

That particular Dremel grinding tool is made of silicon carbide, one of the very hardest substances known. It's actually the 4th hardest substance known. Only 3 other substances exist that it can't scratch. You really don't want to put your SGP in your pocket if you have a bunch of silicon carbide in there.

Now look real closely at that video and you'll see that he isn't exerting any pressure on the tool. He doesn't really have to. There are millions of little cutting edges on the surface of that tool that's rotating above 30,000 RPM. It's going to abrade anything it touches.

But what if he had put a little pressure on it? You can be very sure it would have eaten through that screen protector like it was nothing. All of the glass would have been scratched. It wouldn't take much pressure and there wouldn't be much difference between the scratching at the top and at the bottom. This was a test that was very carefully done to convince people to buy their products. It's not dishonest. It's just salesmanship.

If the screen protector gives you some peace of mind then, of course, use it. I sometimes buy an extended warranty for a product I really care about even though I know it's silly as an investment but I want the peace of mind. That makes sense. Just be sure you know why you're doing it. It's not about protecting your screen, it's about protecting you.

Barry
I agree Barry. I generally try to avoid using the side grinder on my 5.0.

Steve
who is quite happy with no protector
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  #27  
Old 07-27-2012, 08:59 PM
FrankB2 FrankB2 is offline
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Originally Posted by crabocado View Post
It's nice to know the 4 and 5 are glass, but is the 4.2? Hopefully?
I only asked the Samsung rep about the 4.0 and 5.0, but would suppose the 4.2 would get the same type of screen.
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  #28  
Old 07-27-2012, 09:27 PM
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Originally Posted by barryem View Post
Sand does have a high quartz content. That's why glass is made from sand.

Of course the glass is refined and treated. I'm not sure if it's harder than sand or not.

Barry
Glass is aboslutely NOT harder than quartz, which is silicon dioxide, which is sand. So far it seems that there has been a decent amount of misinformation in this thread.

Yes sand WILL scratch your Gorilla Glass screens, they will scratch them just as well as any other glass screen.

The reason a screen protector will hold up to quarts is because it isn't hard, it is soft, which will bend to fit the grain of sand, then then flex back to its original position. Obviously if you apply enough pressure over a large enough area then the plastic will bend to greatly to go back to its original state.

I personally use 3M Clear Bra on my screens, and the rest of my DAPs or cellphones that I care about. It is designed to be used on car bumpers, which takes tons of damage from rocks and such.

I've never had any issues with it peeling off of my DAP's(applied it to over 15 devices) even when some of them were left on the dash of my car in 100 degree F. Thats 100 degrees outside, on the dash it gets hot enough you can barely hold the DAP, which isn't good for the battery incase you are wondering.

Here is a easily understandable graphical chart about hardness and what certain substances rate at.

Please note that Quartz(sand) is number 7, while glass is down around 6. And Gorilla Glass is designed to take more impact than normal glass, though it does have more scratch resistance than normal glass, its best function is the impact resistance and the flexibility. There is a video at the bottom demonstrating this.



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  #29  
Old 07-28-2012, 05:44 AM
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Originally Posted by Syndrome View Post
... I personally use 3M Clear Bra on my screens, and the rest of my DAPs or cellphones that I care about. It is designed to be used on car bumpers, which takes tons of damage from rocks and such. ...
Please tell us the story of how the protector helped the s9 from papi, oh and do you still have the pic
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  #30  
Old 07-28-2012, 12:11 PM
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Hmm... can't find pics of it after I stepped on it, but when I did that I didn't have any screen protector on it. And this is how my S9's Gorilla Glass looked without a screen protector. The first scratched happened in my pocket the first day I had it.

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  #31  
Old 07-28-2012, 01:19 PM
barryem barryem is offline
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Originally Posted by Syndrome View Post
Glass is aboslutely NOT harder than quartz, which is silicon dioxide, which is sand. So far it seems that there has been a decent amount of misinformation in this thread.

Yes sand WILL scratch your Gorilla Glass screens, they will scratch them just as well as any other glass screen.

The reason a screen protector will hold up to quarts is because it isn't hard, it is soft, which will bend to fit the grain of sand, then then flex back to its original position. Obviously if you apply enough pressure over a large enough area then the plastic will bend to greatly to go back to its original state.

I personally use 3M Clear Bra on my screens, and the rest of my DAPs or cellphones that I care about. It is designed to be used on car bumpers, which takes tons of damage from rocks and such.

I've never had any issues with it peeling off of my DAP's(applied it to over 15 devices) even when some of them were left on the dash of my car in 100 degree F. Thats 100 degrees outside, on the dash it gets hot enough you can barely hold the DAP, which isn't good for the battery incase you are wondering.

Here is a easily understandable graphical chart about hardness and what certain substances rate at.

Please note that Quartz(sand) is number 7, while glass is down around 6. And Gorilla Glass is designed to take more impact than normal glass, though it does have more scratch resistance than normal glass, its best function is the impact resistance and the flexibility. There is a video at the bottom demonstrating this.
According to Wikipdia, glass varies from 6 to 7 on the Moh scale, depending on it's type.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mohs_sc...neral_hardness

I googled "Moh hardness of Gorilla Glass" and found it to be 9 on the hardness scale.
http://chemistry.about.com/od/howthi...illa-Glass.htm

Hardness is, of course, of scratch resistance. When two objects rub together with enough force the harder will scratch the softer.

Protecting bumpers from flying rocks is more about impact resistance, which Corning says is another major feature of Gorilla Glass.

Barry
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  #32  
Old 07-28-2012, 01:25 PM
barryem barryem is offline
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Originally Posted by Syndrome View Post
Hmm... can't find pics of it after I stepped on it, but when I did that I didn't have any screen protector on it. And this is how my S9's Gorilla Glass looked without a screen protector. The first scratched happened in my pocket the first day I had it.

I bought my S9 in 2009. They first went on sale in 2008. The Ipad, which was the first device, as I recall, to have Gorilla Glass, became available in 2010. I'll be very surprised if the S9 has Gorilla Glass.

Barry
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  #33  
Old 07-28-2012, 01:26 PM
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I'm absolutely positive that Gorilla Glass isn't stronger than quartz, which is a 7 on the hardness scale. As my post previous to yours has shown. I know how hardness works, and pressure is needed to make scratches.

If it was really a 9, then all of this sand around me must most definitely be diamond, yes that must be the case... BRB I've gotta go outside and start gathering that stuff up!

Edit: This came out of the article you cited as a source....

"In 2006, Steve Jobs contacted Wendell Weeks, the CEO of Corning, seeking a strong, scratch-resistant glass for Apple's iPhone. With the success of the iPhone, Corning's glass has been adopted for use in numerous similar devices."


And here is another video on the original Gorilla Glass.

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  #34  
Old 07-28-2012, 02:16 PM
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Originally Posted by barryem View Post
I bought my S9 in 2009. They first went on sale in 2008. The Ipad, which was the first device, as I recall, to have Gorilla Glass, became available in 2010. I'll be very surprised if the S9 has Gorilla Glass.

Barry
Surprise the S9 did have Corning Gorilla Glass, have a read here. Unless that article by Enzo isn't correct, but my guess is he did his homework and found out for sure before he went to print. BTW where would we be without Al Gore inventing the internet or apple first at making everything
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  #35  
Old 07-29-2012, 09:13 AM
barryem barryem is offline
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Originally Posted by Syndrome View Post
I'm absolutely positive that Gorilla Glass isn't stronger than quartz, which is a 7 on the hardness scale. As my post previous to yours has shown. I know how hardness works, and pressure is needed to make scratches.

If it was really a 9, then all of this sand around me must most definitely be diamond, yes that must be the case... BRB I've gotta go outside and start gathering that stuff up!

"In 2006, Steve Jobs contacted Wendell Weeks, the CEO of Corning, seeking a strong, scratch-resistant glass for Apple's iPhone. With the success of the iPhone, Corning's glass has been adopted for use in numerous similar devices."
I haven't done any hardness tests on any kind of glass or on anything else. All I can go by is what I read. If you disagree you might want to let Corning know about their mistakes.

Gorilla Glass isn't new. It just wasn't used until the Ipad. I saw a documentary made by Corning some time back where they mentioned that it was developed in the 1960's. Or maybe it was the 50's. I forget now. It was developed as part of some other process and not because they wanted Gorilla Glass. At that time they thought it was interesting but saw no practical use for it and it got put aside until Steve Jobs contacted them.

Barry
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  #36  
Old 07-29-2012, 09:28 AM
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Surprise the S9 did have Corning Gorilla Glass, have a read. Unless that article by Enzo isn't correct, but my guess is he did his homework and found out for sure before he went to print. BTW where would we be without Al Gore inventing the internet or apple first at making everything
I just read that article. The author is obviously implying that the S9 uses Gorilla Glass but he never actually says that. I wonder if he's kind of hoping that it uses it and thinking it might but he's not real sure. It does seem like he intentionally avoided saying it was Gorilla Glass.

As to Al Gore inventing the internet, if you'll read the Snopes article you cited you'll see that he never made that claim. The press twisted what he said to make him seem ridiculous and it stuck. The article you cited about the S9 being made of Gorilla Glass might be another example of twisting things by someone who might be considered a member of the press.

Not that any of this really matters. There are so many urban legends we can never really know which are true and which are not. That's just the way the world is. I just think it's worthwhile to try to keep to the facts when we can.

Barry
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  #37  
Old 07-29-2012, 09:41 AM
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In Steve Job's biography he says that the iphone has been using gorilla glass. Here is a small article about the exchange and situation. Pick up the biography if you want to read it in full context.

And about Gorilla Glass, yes it is strong, I would rather it over anything else on my DAP's and Cellphones, but there is a big misconception about HOW strong it is.
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  #38  
Old 07-29-2012, 11:12 AM
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Gorilla Glass has definitely been used on more than just the iPads... More than just Apple products, too.
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  #39  
Old 07-29-2012, 01:08 PM
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Originally Posted by barryem View Post
I just read that article. The author is obviously implying that the S9 uses Gorilla Glass but he never actually says that. I wonder if he's kind of hoping that it uses it and thinking it might but he's not real sure. It does seem like he intentionally avoided saying it was Gorilla Glass.

...The article you cited about the S9 being made of Gorilla Glass might be another example of twisting things by someone who might be considered a member of the press.

...I just think it's worthwhile to try to keep to the facts when we can.

Barry
In the interest of keeping to the facts when we can, did you also read that article's link to the press release by Corning itself which unequivocally states the Cowon S9 uses Gorilla Glass?
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  #40  
Old 07-29-2012, 01:27 PM
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I have used and swear by Zagg screen protectors.

You can take the film off and run it under water to remove the dirt, then re-apply. I has work for me. The adhesiveness comes back.

On the other hand. I have remove film protector from all my Android devices. The film inhibits the use of a stylus. It has been 5 mos since I have removed the film from my devices and every device but the phone is in a case anyway. The Evo has some scratches but not really noticeable and I'm cool with that.

As far as replacements go. I have had no response from Zagg for a replacement for a Asus Screen Protector. I made the request in Dec and yes all my Zagg products are registered. It seems I didn't really needed it anyway.
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